the law and testimony vs. scholarship & manuscripts
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#1: the law and testimony vs. scholarship & manuscripts Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 1:27 am
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Isaiah 8:20
If any man want light, let him look upon the law and the testimony whether they speak not after this meaning.


Psalms 100:5
For the LORD is gracious, his mercy is everlasting, and his truth endureth from generation to generation.


To scholars' shame of today even with many bible translations and technology tools.. that knowledge doesn't even come near to the devout people's wisdom of old that kept the truth real with great purety at heart.

Yea, and who is anybody to say that today there's better "scholarship" than the devout fathers and mothers who faithfully passed the truth to their children?

Brings to attention:

Isaiah 45:9-10
9Woe be unto him that chideth with his maker, the potsherd with the potter: Sayeth the clay to the potter: What makest thou? or thy work serveth for nothing?  10Woe be unto him, that sayeth to his father: Why begettest thou? And to his mother: Why bearest thou?  


Even the following translations of the New Testament by a mere martyr in the 1500s still faithfully stand out against all others today:
Quote:

... covetousness is the root of all evil ..
1 Timothy 6:10
For covetousness is the root of all evil, which while some lusted after, they erred from the faith, and tangled themselves with many sorrows.


... Lord of life ..
Acts 3:15
and killed the Lord of life whom God hath raised from death, of the which we are witnesses:


... this fold .. one flock,
John 10:16
and other sheep I have, which are not of this fold. Them also must I bring, that they shall hear my voice. And there shall be one flock, and one shepherd.


... intent, that none that believe in him, should perish: But should have everlasting life.
John 3:15-19
15that none which believeth in him perish: but have eternal life.  16 God so loved the world, that he gave his only son for the intent, that none that believe in him, should perish: But should have everlasting life.  17For God sent not his son into the world, to condemn the world: But that the world through him, might be saved.   18He that believeth on him shall not be condemned. But he that believeth not, is condemned all ready, because he believeth not in the name of the only son of God.  19And this is the condemnation: Light is come into the world, and the men have loved darkness more than light, because their deeds were evil.  


... seat of mercy ..
Romans 3:25
whom God hath made a seat of mercy thorow faith in his blood, to shew the righteousness which before him is of valour, in that he forgiveth the sins that are passed,


... profession of our hope ..
Hebrews 10:23
and let us keep the profession of our hope, without wavering (for he is faithful that promised)


... noblest among them of Thessalonia ..
Acts 17:11
These were the noblest among them of Thessalonia, which received the word with all diligence of mind, and searched the scriptures daily whether those things were even so.


... scripture came never by the will of man..
2 Peter 1:21
For the scripture came never by the will of man: but wholy men of God spake as they were moved by the wholy ghost.


... On a Sabbath day ..
Acts 20:7
On a Sabbath day the disciples came together for to break bread, and Paul preached unto them (ready to depart on the morrow) and continued the preaching unto midnight.


... In some Sabbath day ..
1 Corinthians 16:2
In some Sabbath day let every one of you put aside at home, and lay up whatsoever he thinketh meet, that there be no gatherings when I come.


... devout .. devotion
James 1:26-27
26If any man among you seem devout, and refrain not his tongue: but deceive his own heart, this man's devotion is in vain.  27Pure devotion and undefiled before God the father, is this: To visit the friendless, and widows in their adversity, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.  


... Christ is to me life, and death is to me advantage.
PHILIPPIANS 1:18-21
18What thing is this? Notwithstanding by all manner ways, whether it be by occasion or of truth, yet Christ is preached: and therefore I joy. Yea and will joy.  19For I know that this shall be for my health, thorow your prayer, and ministering of the spirit of Jesu Christ,  20as I heartily look for and hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed: but that with all confidence, as always in times past, even so now Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be thorow life, or else death.  21For Christ is to me life, and death is to me advantage.  


... Lord over the kings ..
Revelation 1:5
and from Jesus Christ which is a faithful witness, and first begotten of the dead: and Lord over the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us and washed us from our sins in his own blood,


Code:

1Co 2:14 For the natural man perceiveth not the things of the spirit of God: For they are but foolishness unto him. Neither can he perceive them because he is spiritually examined: <|can not perceive it: for it must be spiritually discerned|>
1Co 2:15 but he that is spiritual discusseth all things: yet he himself is judged of no man.
1Co 2:16 For who knoweth the mind of the Lord, other who shall inform him? but we understand the mind of Christ.


Last edited by JAdmin on Sun Dec 24, 2006 1:36 pm; edited 5 times in total

#2:  Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:42 pm
    —
JAdmin wrote:

Code:

1Co 2:14 For the natural man perceiveth not the things of the spirit of God: For they are but foolishness unto him. Neither can he perceive them because he is spiritually examined: <|can not perceive it: for it must be spiritually discerned|>
1Co 2:15 but he that is spiritual discusseth all things: yet he himself is judged of no man.
1Co 2:16 For who knoweth the mind of the Lord, other who shall inform him? but we understand the mind of Christ.

1 Cor 2:14 But he animal man does not receive the things of the spirit of the God: for to him it is foolishness and because it is spiritually examined he is not able to know.

1 Cor 2:15 But the spiritual examines all things himself but is examined by no one.
1 Cor 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord? Who instrusts him? But we have the mind of the Anointed.

The above in blue is from the most ancient and complete manuscript known as the Codex Vaticanus (B), late 2nd or early 3rd Century!

#3:  Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 9:12 pm
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heman wrote:

1 Cor 2:14 But he animal man does not receive the things of the spirit of the God: for to him it is foolishness and because it is spiritually examined he is not able to know.

1 Cor 2:15 But the spiritual examines all things himself but is examined by no one.
1 Cor 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord? Who instrusts him? But we have the mind of the Anointed.

The above in blue is from the most ancient and complete manuscript known as the Codex Vaticanus (B), late 2nd or early 3rd Century!


Only because something is completely older, doesn't mean that it is more truthful. (see post: Ps. 68:27 DILIGENCIA in reverence to the Sovereign LORd)
According to the prophets the truth comes to light just by the law and the testimony passed faithfully from generation to generation.

Isaiah 8:20
If any man want light, let him look upon the law and the testimony whether they speak not after this meaning.


Deuteronomy 30:10-14
10If thou hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and ordinances which are written in the book of this law, if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart and all thy soul.  11For the commandment which I command thee this day, is not separated from thee neither far off.  12It is not in heaven, that thou needest to say: who shall go up for us into heaven, and fetch it us, that we may hear it and do it:  13Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say: who shall go over sea for us and fetch it us that we may hear it and do it.  14But the word is very nigh unto thee: even in thy mouth and in thine heart, that thou do it.  

Proverbs 30:4
Who hath climbed up into heaven? Who hath come down from thence? Who hath holden the wind fast in his hand? Who hath comprehended the waters in a garment? Who hath set all the ends of the world? What is his name, or his son's name? Canst thou tell?


Yea and i perceive before it was even written, it was completely passed orally via godly costumes. And i pray that today more than ever the Lord mightily shew his verity thorow his spirit (without even the need of anything written) to put all those worldly scholars to shame.

1 Corinthians 1:19-21
19For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise and will cast away the understanding of the prudent.  20Where is the wise man? where is the scribe? where is the searcher of this world? Hath not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness?  21For when the world thorow wisdom knew not God, in the wisdom of God: it pleased God thorow foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.  


Jeremiah 8:8-9
8How dare ye say then: we are wise, we have the law of the LORD among us? Behold, the deceitful pen of the scribes, setteth forth lies:  9therefore shall the wise be confounded, they shall be afraid and taken: for lo, they have cast out the word of the LORD: what wisdom can then be among them?  


1 Corinthians 3:19-20
19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written: he compasseth the wise in their craftiness.  20And again, God knoweth the thoughts of the wise that they be vain.  

#4:  Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:34 pm
    —
JAdmin wrote:
heman wrote:

1 Cor 2:14 But he animal man does not receive the things of the spirit of the God: for to him it is foolishness and because it is spiritually examined he is not able to know.

1 Cor 2:15 But the spiritual examines all things himself but is examined by no one.
1 Cor 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord? Who instrusts him? But we have the mind of the Anointed.

The above in blue is from the most ancient and complete manuscript known as the Codex Vaticanus (B), late 2nd or early 3rd Century!


Only because something is completely older, doesn't mean that it is more truthful. (see post: Ps. 68:27 DILIGENCIA in reverence to the Sovereign LORd)
According to the prophets the truth comes to light just by the law and the testimony passed faithfully from generation to generation.

Isaiah 8:20
If any man want light, let him look upon the law and the testimony whether they speak not after this meaning.


Deuteronomy 30:10-14
10If thou hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and ordinances which are written in the book of this law, if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart and all thy soul.  11For the commandment which I command thee this day, is not separated from thee neither far off.  12It is not in heaven, that thou needest to say: who shall go up for us into heaven, and fetch it us, that we may hear it and do it:  13Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say: who shall go over sea for us and fetch it us that we may hear it and do it.  14But the word is very nigh unto thee: even in thy mouth and in thine heart, that thou do it.  

Proverbs 30:4
Who hath climbed up into heaven? Who hath come down from thence? Who hath holden the wind fast in his hand? Who hath comprehended the waters in a garment? Who hath set all the ends of the world? What is his name, or his son's name? Canst thou tell?


Yea and i perceive before it was even written, it was completely passed orally via godly costumes. And i pray that today more than ever the Lord mightily shew his verity thorow his spirit (without even the need of anything written) to put all those worldly scholars to shame.

1 Corinthians 1:19-21
19For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise and will cast away the understanding of the prudent.  20Where is the wise man? where is the scribe? where is the searcher of this world? Hath not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness?  21For when the world thorow wisdom knew not God, in the wisdom of God: it pleased God thorow foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.  


Jeremiah 8:8-9
8How dare ye say then: we are wise, we have the law of the LORD among us? Behold, the deceitful pen of the scribes, setteth forth lies:  9therefore shall the wise be confounded, they shall be afraid and taken: for lo, they have cast out the word of the LORD: what wisdom can then be among them?  


1 Corinthians 3:19-20
19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written: he compasseth the wise in their craftiness.  20And again, God knoweth the thoughts of the wise that they be vain.  

Ac 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

The reading of John 3:14 shows the way the translators missed the (αυτω) when the example of Moses was given. In other words anyone who believes in Moses and the prophets should not be destroyed but have age-lasting life.
That was the example that was being proclaimed!

Joh 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That everyone which believeth in them (αυτω)should not be destroyed, but have age-lasting life.
16 Thus for God loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that everyone who believes in him may not be destroyed but have age-lasting life.
17 For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth in him will not be judged:he that believeth not is judged already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the judgement, that the light has come into the world, and the men loved darkness rather than the light, for their works were evil.

Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also it behooves me to lead, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one flock, and one shepherd.

Ac 3:15 And you killed the founder (747) of life, whom God hath raised out of dead ones; of whom we are witnesses.

Ac 17:11 These were more well known than those of Thessalonica, who received the word with all promptness, and closely scrutinizing the writings every day, if these things were so.

Ac 20:7 ? And on a sabbath day the disciples came together to break bread, Paul discoursed to them, being about to depart on the morrow; and continued his discourse till midnight.

Ro 3:25 Whom God set forth to be a mercy-seat through the faith by the blood of himself, to show the righteousness of him for the remission of sins that are past, in the forbearance of God;

1Co 1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will disregard the understanding of the experts.
20 Where is the wise man? where is the scribe? where is the debater of this age? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For when the world in the wisdom of God the world through wisdom knew not God, God was pleased through the foolishness of the proclamation to save the believing ones.

1Co 3:19 For the wisdom of the world this is foolishness with God. For it has been written, He is catching the wise ones in their own craftiness.
20 And again, The Lord knows the reasonings of the wise ones, that they are vain.

1Co 16:2 According to one week let every one of you by yourself in treasuring up what things as hath prospered, so that there be no collections made when I come.

1Ti 6:10 The love of money is the root for all evil: which some reached for, they have wandered from the faith, and pierced themselves around with many sorrows.

Jas 1:26 If anyonethinks to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this religion is vain. 27 Pure and undefiled with God and Father is this, To oversee orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

2Pe 1:21 For the prophecy was not brought at any time by the will of man: but men by God spoke being moved by the Holy Spirit.

Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the confession of the hope unwavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)

Tit 1:2 In hope of age-lasting life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

#5: i believe in Jesu Christ himself Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 10:45 pm
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Believe in whom?

John 5:39-47
39Search the scriptures, for in them, ye think ye have eternal life: And they are they which testify of me.  40And yet will ye not come to me that ye might have life.  41I receive not praise of men:  42But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.  43I am come in my father's name, and ye receive me not. If another shall come in his own name, him will ye receive.  44How can ye believe, which receive praise one of another, and seek not the praise which cometh of God only?  45Suppose not, that I will accuse you to my father. There is one that accuseth you, verily Moses in whom ye trust.  46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: For he wrote of me.  47But when ye believe not his writing: how shall ye believe my words.  


Psalms 118:8
It is better to trust in the LORD, than to put any confidence in man.


Jeremiah 17:7-8
7O Blissed is the man, that putteth his trust in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is himself.  8For he shall be as a tree, that is planted by the water side: which spreadeth out the root unto moistness, whom the heat can not harm, when it cometh, but his leaves are green. And though there grow but little fruit because of drought, yet is he not careful, but he never leaveth off to bring forth fruit.  


Last edited by JAdmin on Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total

#6: Re: i believe in Jesu Christ himself Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:24 am
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JAdmin wrote:
Believe in whom?

John 5:39-47
39Search the scriptures, for in them, ye think ye have eternal life: And they are they which testify of me.  40And yet will ye not come to me that ye might have life.  41I receive not praise of men:  42But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.  43I am come in my father's name, and ye receive me not. If another shall come in his own name, him will ye receive.  44How can ye believe, which receive praise one of another, and seek not the praise which cometh of God only?  45Suppose not, that I will accuse you to my father. There is one that accuseth you, verily Moses in whom ye trust.  46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: For he wrote of me.  47But when ye believe not his writing: how shall ye believe my words.  


Psalms 118:8
It is better to trust in the LORD, than to put any confidence in man.


Jeremiah 17:7-8
7O Blissed is the man, that putteth his trust in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is himself.  8For he shall be as a tree, that is planted by the water side: which spreadeth out the root unto moistness, whom the heat can not harm, when it cometh, but his leaves are green. And though there grow but little fruit because of drought, yet is he not careful, but he never leaveth off to bring forth fruit.  



Ac 28:23 ? And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.

1Jo 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

1Jo 5:9 If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater: for this is the testimony of God which he hath testified concerning his Son.

1Jo 5:11 And this is the testimony, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

Joh 3:34 For whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure.

Joh 5:39 You search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are those which testify concerning me.

#7: YEA as Christ the RISEN Lord taught Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:49 am
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Luke 24:1-53
1On the morrow after the Sabbath, early in the morning, they came unto the tomb and brought the odours which they had prepared, and other women with them.  2And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre,  3and went in: but found not the body of the Lord Jesu.  4And it happened, as they were amazed thereat: lo two men stood by them, in shining vestures.  5And as they were afraid, and bowed down their faces to the earth: they said to them: why seek ye the living among the dead?  6He is not here: but is risen. Remember how he spake unto you, when he was yet with you in Galilee,  7saying: that the son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.  8And they remembered his words,  9and returned from the sepulchre, and told all these things unto the eleven, and to all other.   10It was Mary Magdalene and Joanna, and Mary Jacobi; And other that were with them, which told these things unto the apostles,  11and their words seemed unto them feigned things, neither believed they them.  12Then arose Peter and ran unto the sepulchre, and stooped in; And saw the linen clothes laid by themself. And departed wondering in himself at that which had happened.  13And behold, two of them went that same day to a town, which was from Jerusalem about three score furlongs, called Emaus:  14and they talked together of all these things that had happened.  15And it chanced, as they communed together, and reasoned, that Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.  16But their eyes were holden, that they could not know him.  17And he said unto them: What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another as ye walk, and are sad?  18And the one of them named Cleopas, answered, and said unto him: art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which have chanced therein in these days?  19To whom he said: what things? And they said unto him: of Jesus of Nazareth which was a prophet, mighty in deed, and word, before God, and all the people.  20And how the high priests, and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death: and have crucified him.  21 We trusted that it should have been he that should have delivered Israel. And as touching all these things, today is even the third day, that they were done.  22Yea and certain women also of our company made us astonied, which came early unto the sepulchre,  23and found not his body. And came saying, that they had seen visions of angels which said that he was alive.  24And certain of them which were with us, went their way to the sepulchre, and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not.  25And he said unto them: O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken.  26Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?  27And he began at Moses, and at all the prophets, and interpreted unto them, in all scriptures which were written of him.  28And they drew nigh unto the town which they went to. And he made, as though he would have gone further.  29And constrained him, saying: Abide with us for it draweth towards night, and the day is far passed. And he went in to tarry with them.  30And it came to pass as he sat at meat with them, he took bread and blessed it, and brake it and gave it unto them.  31And their eyes were opened. And they knew him. And he vanished out of their sight,  32and they said between themselves: did not our hearts burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and opened to us the scriptures?  33And they rose up the same hour, and returned again to Jerusalem, and found the eleven gathered together, and them that were with them,  34saying: The Lord is risen in deed, and hath appeared to Simon.  35And they told what things was done in the way, and how they knew him, by the breaking of bread.  36As they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and said unto them: peace be with you. ([It is I, fear not])  37And they were abashed, and afraid, supposing that they had seen a spirit.  38And he said unto them: Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?  39Behold my hands and my feet. For it is even I myself. Handle me and see. For spirits have not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.  40And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands, and his feet.  41And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them: Have ye here any meat?  42and they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.  43And he took it, and ate it before them.  44And he said unto them: These are the words, which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you: that all must be fulfilled which were written of me in the law of Moses, and in the Prophets, and in the Psalms.  45Then opened he their wits, that they might understand the scriptures,  46and said unto them: Thus is it written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise again from death the third day.  47And that repentance, and remission of sins, should be preached in his name among all nations. And the beginning must be at Jerusalem.  48And ye are witnesses of these things.  49And behold, I will send the promise of my father upon you. But tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.   50And he led them out into Bethany, and lift up his hands, and blest them.  51And it came to pass, as he blessed them, he departed from them, and was carried up into heaven.  52And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy.  53And were continually in the temple, praising, and lauding God. Here endeth the Gospell off Sainct Luke.  

#8: "Little Words Mean A Lot! Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:24 pm
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It is amazing how "one little word" can make the meaning so much plainer!
Bolded words REPLACE the Underlined words that are to be omitted and are the actual reading. (SEE VERSE 49 "TILL YE BE CLOTHED WITH POWER"
Luke 24:1-53
1 In the first of the Sabbath, early in the morning, they came unto the tomb and brought the odours what they prepared, OMIT:and other women with them. 2 And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre, 3 OMIT:and went in having entered: OMIT:but and found not the body of the Lord Jesus. 4 And it happened, as they were OMIT:amazed thereat in a quandary : lo two men stood by them, OMIT:in shining vestures. attire like flashing lighting 5 And as they were afraid, OMIT:and bowed down their faces bowing the face to the earth: they said to them: why seek ye the living among the dead ones? 6 He is not here: OMIT:is risen but has been raised Remember how he spake unto you, when he was yet with you in Galilee, 7 saying: OMIT:that the it behooves the son of man OMIT:must to be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and to be OMIT:crucified fixed on a stake and the third day to rise again. 8 And they remembered his words, 9 and returned from the OMIT:sepulchre tomb, and told all these things unto the eleven, and to all the others. 10 It was Mary Magdalene and Joanna, and Mary OMIT:Jacobi of James And the others that were with them, OMIT:which told who spoke these things to the apostles, 11and their words seemed unto them OMIT:feigned things neither believed they them idle tales and they believed them not. 12 Then arose Peter and ran unto the sepulchre, and stooped in; And saw the linen clothes laid by themself. And departed wondering in himself at that OMIT:which had happened what had occurred. 13 And behold, two of them went that same day to a OMIT:town village, which was from Jerusalem about OMIT:three score sixty furlongs, called Emaus: 14 and they talked together of all these things that had happened. 15And it OMIT:chanceD occurred, as they OMIT:communed talked together, and reasoned, OMIT:that and Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. 16 But their eyes were holden, that they OMIT:couldnot knew him. 17And he said unto them: What OMIT:manner of communications words are these that ye have one to another as ye walk, and are sad? 18 And the one of them named Cleopas, answered, and said unto him: art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which have OMIT:chanced been done therein in her OMIT:these days ? 19 And OMIT:To whom he said to them: what things? And they said unto him: of the things about Jesus OMIT:of Nazareth which the Nazarine, a prophet, who was a man, OMIT:mighty powerful in OMIT:deed work, and word, omit:before in the presence of God, and all the people. 20 And how the high priests, and our rulers delivered him up omit:to be condemned sentenced to death: and omit:have crucified him to be fixed on a stake. 21 We omit:trusted hoped that it omit:should have had been that he omit:should have delivered was about to redeem Israel. omit:And as touching But besides all these things, today is omit:even the third day, that they omit:were done occurred. 22 omit:Yea and certain But also our women omit:also of our company made us astonied us, which came early unto the omit:sepulchre tomb, 23 and found not his body. And came saying, that they had seen visions of angels whichomit: said say that he OMIT:was is alive. 24 And OMITcertain some of them OMIT:which were went with us, OMIT:went their way to the sepulchre, to the tomb and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not. 25 And he said unto them: O OMIT:fools, thoughtless and slow with the heart to believe all that the prophets OMIT:have spoken which spoke. 26 OMIT:Ought Were not Christ to have suffered these binding things, and to enter into his glory? 27 OMIT:And he began And beginning at Moses, and at all the prophets, OMIT:and interpreted he explained to them, in all scriptures OMIT:which were written of the things about himself. 28 And they drew nigh near unto theOMIT: town which they went to village where they were going. And he made, as though he would have gone further. 29 OMIT:And constrained But they pressed him, saying: Abide with us for it OMIT:draweth towards night, is evening and the day is far passed. And he went in toOMIT: tarry abide with them. 30 And it OMIT:came to pass happened as he OMIT:sat at meat reclined with them, he took OMIT:bread a loaf and blessed it, and brake it and gave it unto them. 31 And their eyes were opened. And they knew him. And he OMIT:vanished out of their sight disappeared from them, 32 and they said between themselves: were not our hearts burning within us, while he talked OMIT:with to us by the way, and as he opened to us the scriptures? 33 And they rose up the same hour, and returned OMIT:again to Jerusalem, and found the eleven OMIT:gathered togetherassembled, and OMIT:them those that were with them, 34saying that: The Lord OMIT:is risen in deed has been raised indeed, and hath appeared to Simon. 35And they OMIT:told what related the things OMIT:was done in the way, and how OMIT:they knew him by that he was known to them in the breaking ofOMIT: breadthe loaf. 36 As they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and said unto them: peace be with you. OMIT:([It is I, fear not]) 37 OMIT:And they were abashed, and afraid supposing that But wailing and fearful thought they had seen a spirit. 38 And he said unto them: Why are ye OMIT:troubled perplexed? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? 39 Behold my hands and my feet OMIT:For it is even I myself that I am he Handle me and look. OMIT:For spirits have A spirit has not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. 40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands, and his feet. 41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and OMIT:wondered marveled, he said unto them: Have ye here OMIT:any meat anything eatable ? 42and they gave him a piece of a broiled fish. OMIT:and of an honeycomb. 43 And he took it, and ate it before them. 44And he said unto them: These are my words, which I spake unto you, while I was OMIT:yet with you: that all the things must be fulfilled which were written concerning me in the law of Moses, and in the Prophets, and OMIT:in the Psalms. 45 Then OMIT:opened accounted he their OMIT:wits mind, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 and said unto them: Thus is it written, OMIT:and thus it behooved the Christ to suffer, and to rise OMIT:again from death up out of dead ones in the third day. 47 And that repentance, andOMIT: remission to forgiveness of sins, should be proclaimed in his name OMIT:among to all the nations. OMIT:And the must be at Beginning from Jerusalem. 48 OMIT:And You are witnesses of these. OMIT:things. 49 And behold, I will send the promise of my father of me upon you. But OMIT:tarry remain ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye beOMIT: endued CLOTHED with power from on high. 50 And He led them out into Bethany, and lifted up his hands, and blessed them. 51 And it OMIT:came to pass happened,as he blessed them, he OMIT:departedSTOOD APART from them, and was carried up into heaven. 52 And they OMIT:worshipped were prostrated before him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy. 53 And were continually in the temple, OMIT:praising, and lauding BLESSING God.OMIT: Here endeth the Gospell off Sainct Luke.

VERSE 30 IT WAS CUSTOMERY IN THAT TIME TO LIE ON A COUCH TO EAT
2625 kataklinw kataklino kat-ak-lee'-no
1) in the NT in reference to eating, to make to recline
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And This is the ACTUAL reading:
Bolded words REPLACE the omitted words
Luke 24:1-53
1 In the first of the Sabbath, early in the morning, they came unto the tomb and brought the odours what they prepared. 2 And they found the stone rolled from the sepulchre, 3 having entered: and found not the body of the Lord Jesus. 4 And it happened, as they were in a quandary : lo two men stood by them, attire like flashing lighting 5 And as they were afraid, bowing the face to the earth: they said to them: why seek ye the living among the dead ones? 6 He is not here: but has been raised. Remember how he spake unto you, when he was yet with you in Galilee, 7 saying: it behooves the son of man to be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and to be fixed on a stake and in the third day to rise again. 8 And they remembered his words, 9 and returned from the tomb, and told all these things unto the eleven, and to all the others. 10 It was Mary Magdalene and Joanna, and Mary of James and the others that were with them, who spoke these things to the apostles, 11and their words seemed unto them idle tales and they believed them not. 12 Then arose Peter and ran unto the sepulchre, and stooped in; And saw the linen clothes laid by themself. And departed wondering in himself at that what had occurred. 13 And behold, two of them went that same day to a village, which was from Jerusalem about sixty furlongs, called Emaus: 14 and they talked together of all these things that had happened. 15And it occurred, as they talked together, and reasoned, and Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. 16 But their eyes were holden, that they not knew him. 17And he said unto them: What words are these that ye have one to another as ye walk, and are sad? 18 And the one of them named Cleopas, answered, and said unto him: art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which have been done there in her? 19 And he said to them: what things? And they said unto him: of the things about Jesus the Nazarine, a prophet, who was a man, powerful in work, and word, in the presence of God, and all the people. 20 And how the high priests, and our rulers delivered him up sentenced to death: to be fixed on a stake. 21 We hoped that it had been that he was about to redeem Israel. But besides all these things, today is the third day, that they occurred. 22 But also our women astonished us, which came early unto the tomb, 23 and found not his body. And came saying, that they had seen visions of angels which say that he is alive. 24 And some of them went with us, to the tomb and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not. 25 And he said unto them: O thoughtless and slow with the heart to believe all that the prophets which spoke. 26 Were not Christ to have suffered these binding things, and to enter into his glory? 27 And beginning at Moses, and at all the prophets, he explained to them, in all scriptures the things about himself. 28 And they drew near unto the village where they were going. And he made, as though he would have gone further. 29 But they pressed him, saying: Abide with us for it is evening and the day is far passed. And he went in to abide with them. 30 And it happened as he reclined with them, he took a loaf and blessed it, and brake it and gave it unto them. 31 And their eyes were opened. And they knew him. And he disappeared from them, 32 and they said between themselves: were not our hearts burning within us, while he talked to us by the way, and as he opened to us the scriptures? 33 And they rose up the same hour, and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven assembled, and those that were with them, 34saying that: The Lord has been raised indeed, and hath appeared to Simon. 35And they related the things in the way, and how that he was known to them in the breaking of the loaf. 36 As they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and said unto them: peace be with you. But wailing and fearful thought they had seen a spirit. 38 And he said unto them: Why are ye perplexed? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? 39 Behold my hands and my feet that I am he. Handle me and look. A spirit has not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. 40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands, and his feet. 41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and marveled, he said unto them: Have ye here anything eatable ? 42 and they gave him a piece of a broiled fish. 43 And he took it, and ate it before them. 44 And he said unto them: These are my words, which I spake unto you, while I was with you: that all the things must be fulfilled which were written concerning me in the law of Moses, and in the Prophets, and the Psalms. 45 Then accounted he their mind, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 and said unto them: Thus is it written, the Christ to suffer, and to rise up out of dead ones in the third day. 47 And that repentance, and to forgiveness of sins, should be proclaimed in his name to all the nations beginning from Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these. 49 And behold, I will send the promise of my father of me upon you. But remain ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be CLOTHED with power from on high. 50 And He led them out into Bethany, and lifted up his hands, and blessed them. 51 And it happened, as he blessed them, he STOOD APART from them, and was carried up into heaven. 52 And they were prostrated before him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy. 53 And were continually in the temple, BLESSING God..

Source: "Codex Vaticanus (B)"

#9: wo Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 9:05 pm
    —
What edification do the omitions on that old manuscript provide?

According to the gospel accounts in unison, the quoted passage with everything included more precicely gives the whole picture.

Moreover, who are we to say.. if some manuscripts were shorten (due to the fact that back then it was tediously hand written, and a shorter scroll was perhaps somehow more convenient) ..
notwithstanding, i perceive that it's message would only keep it's weight with the help of the wholy ghost, as i hope it is the case with your devout understanding thereof.

I perceive that the author of verity is not limited to manuscripts (or even the original English translation) that amazingly circulated til today.. And even without needing the help of any worldly organization, institution, or a bunch of carnal men for that matter.

1 Corinthians 1:19-29
19For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise and will cast away the understanding of the prudent.  20Where is the wise man? where is the scribe? where is the searcher of this world? Hath not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness?  21For when the world thorow wisdom knew not God, in the wisdom of God: it pleased God thorow foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.  22For the jews require a sign, and the greeks seek after wisdom.  23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the jews an occasion of falling and unto the greeks foolishness:  24but unto them which are called both of jews and greeks we preach Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.  25For Godly foolishness is wiser than men: And Godly weakness is stronger than are men.  26Brethren look on your calling how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many of high degree are called:  27But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world, to confound the wise. And hath chosen the weak things of the world, to confound things which are mighty.  28And vile things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen yea and things of no reputation, for to bring to nought things of reputation,  29that no flesh should rejoice in his presence.  

#10: Re: wo Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:54 pm
    —
JAdmin wrote:
What edification do the omitions on that old manuscript provide?
According to the gospel accounts in unison, the quoted passage with everything included more precicely gives the whole picture.

1 IN THE FIRST OF THE SABBATH (this signifies the 1st day of the Sabbath) 1On the morrow after the Sabbath? and other women with them ( not after the Sabbath and It does not say "other women with them")

4 in a QUANDARY (they were "amazed" is quite different from in a quandary (perplexed state-confused)

ATTIRE LIKE FLASHING LIGHTNING (in shining vestures. esqhsiV 2067 Clothing, attire. astr?aptw 797 To flash lightning.) and meaning that the 2 men looked as though they glowed brightly with eminence and would be more significant "than shining vestures".

5 BOWING THE FACE (seems more appropriate to being prostrated) than "bowed down their faces"

6 BUT HAS BEEN RAISED (has been takes the idea of already accomplished and is more coherent) where "is risen" implies that it is present not past participle.

7 saying: IT BEHOOVES the son of man to be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and
TO BE FIXED ON A STAKE
and IN the third day to rise again.
( behooves implies an "OBLIGATION" and which "the son of man must be delivered" means very probably and not as clear as OBLIGATED to be fixed on a stake does, signifying the actual method of punishment.)

10 IDLE TALES AND THEY BELIEVED THEM NOT. (seemed unto them "feigned things" is to pretend things and does not convey the idea of "IDLE TALES")

15 OCCURRED as they TALKED together, and reasoned, (chanced is a possibility and not a fact whereas "occurred" is already happening. "as they communed" is intimate conversation whereas "talked" is to speak words and is more distinctly applied.)

17 What WORDS are these ("manner of communications" or what way of doing; whereas "words" implies speech)


18 BEEN DONE there in HER ("chanced" again conveys a possibility; whereas "been done" has already happened therein in "her" appears in the MSS signifying Jerusalem and "these days" does not appear in the MSS.)

19 THE THINGS ABOUT Jesus (helps to show what they said to him.)
WHO WAS A MAN, (the word "MAN" simplifies the nature of Christ before his resurrection)
POWERFUL in WORK, and word, ("deed" is something that is done; whereas "work" is labor or occupation)

IN THE PRESENCE OF God ("before" simply means in front of; "IN THE PRESENCE OF" conveys the state of being present in the face of God.)

20 delivered him UP SENTENCED TO DEATH ("to be condemned" is future tense; "SENTENCED TO DEATH" is past tense, the sentence had already happened.)

TO BE FIXED ON A STAKE ("have crucified him" does not show the proper way of execution)

21 We HOPED that it ("trusted" means relied upon; "HOPED" is the source or cause of belief)

HAD BEEN ("should have" suggests a possibility; whereas " HAD BEEN" means it was possible)

that he was ABOUT TO REDEEM Israel ("should have delivered" suggests a possibility; whereas "ABOUT TO REDEEM" implies that it is going to happen even though it did not at that time.)



23 which SAY ("said" is past tense; whereas "SAY" is present tense even to this day.)

that he IS alive ("was" past tense; whereas "IS" is present tense even to this day.)

26 Were not Christ to have suffered these BINDING things, ("BINDING" means he was obligated and it is in the MSS.)

27 he EXPLAINED to them, in all scriptures (and "interpreted" means to clarify; whereas "EXPLAINED" means to make understandable or meaningful.)

THE THINGS ABOUT HIMSELF ("which were written of" implies something vague; whereas "THE THINGS ABOUT HIMSELF" tells you exactly what he explained to them.

30 it HAPPENED as he RECLINED with them ( The MSS says: (2625 kataklinw to make to recline)
(IT WAS CUSTOMERY IN THAT TIME TO LIE ON A COUCH TO EAT )

34 HAS BEEN RAISED INDEED ("is raised in deed" is present tense; whereas "HAS BEEN RAISED INDEED" is past tense)

37 BUT WAILING AND FEARFUL THOUGHT ("abashed and afraid" is to be ashamed; whereas "WAILING AND FEARFUL THOUGHT" portrays a mournful cry and thought is not to suppose but to consider)

38 Why are ye PERPLEXED?("troubled"is worried; and whereas it does not show the bewilderment of "PERPLEXED")

39 that I AM he. ("For it is even I, myself" does not even come close to the words "I AM"!!!) Re 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come

40 ANYTHING EATABLE ("Any meat" means lamb, fish; whereas "ANYTHING EATABLE" means just that ANYTHING."
"And of an honeycomb" is not in the MSS.)

43 These are MY words ("the words" only show words in general; whereas "MY WORDS" point exactly to Jesus) (see verse 27)

that all THE things ("that all" is more general; whereas "all THE things " continues verse 27 all the things about himself)

CONCERNING me ("of ME" is not as clear; whereas "CONCERNING me" continues the verse 43 of "my words")

45 ACCOUNTED he their MIND ("Opened Wits" is less revealing; whereas "ACCOUNTED he their MIND " is a portrayal of him giving account to their minds the understanding of scriptures about him.)

47 to FORGIVENESS of sins, ("And remission" is forgiveness; whereas "TO FORGIVENESS" requires the action of submitting to someone else.)

49 my father OF ME upon you. ((My father" does not convey the promise; whereas "OF ME" tells us what promise God made and as verse 43 says "about Jesus" "concerning me")

until ye be CLOTHED ("Endued" suggests to put on or provide; whereas "CLOTHED" is to cover over as with a garment.

Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:)

53 and WERE PROSTRATED BEFORE him ("worshipped him" is a prayer showing devotion; whereas "WERE PROSTRATED BEFORE " indicates in front of His face and lying with the face downward in demonstration of great humility and abject submission.) (SEE verse 5)

53 BLESSING God ("Lauding and praising" is saying the same as praising and praising; whereas "BLESSING" is to invoke a devine favor.


JAdmin wrote:

Moreover, who are we to say.. if some manuscripts were shorten (due to the fact that back then it was tediously hand written, and a shorter scroll was perhaps somehow more convenient) ..
notwithstanding, i perceive that it's message would only keep it's weight with the help of the wholy ghost, as i hope it is the case with your devout understanding thereof.

I perceive that the author of verity is not limited to manuscripts (or even the original English translation) that amazingly circulated til today.. And even without needing the help of any worldly organization, institution, or a bunch of carnal men for that matter.

1 Corinthians 1:19-29
19For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise and will cast away the understanding of the prudent.  20Where is the wise man? where is the scribe? where is the searcher of this world? Hath not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness?  21For when the world thorow wisdom knew not God, in the wisdom of God: it pleased God thorow foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.  22For the jews require a sign, and the greeks seek after wisdom.  23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the jews an occasion of falling and unto the greeks foolishness:  24but unto them which are called both of jews and greeks we preach Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.  25For Godly foolishness is wiser than men: And Godly weakness is stronger than are men.  26Brethren look on your calling how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many of high degree are called:  27But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world, to confound the wise. And hath chosen the weak things of the world, to confound things which are mighty.  28And vile things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen yea and things of no reputation, for to bring to nought things of reputation,  29that no flesh should rejoice in his presence.  

#11: Re: wo Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:58 am
    —
Jadmin wrote:
What edification do the omitions on that old manuscript provide?
According to the gospel accounts in unison, the quoted passage with everything included more precicely gives the whole picture.

heman wrote:

1 IN THE FIRST OF THE SABBATH (this signifies the 1st day of the Sabbath) 1On the morrow after the Sabbath? and other women with them ( not after the Sabbath and It does not say "other women with them")


The Gospel's unison speaks for itself:
Matthew 28:1
The Sabbath day at even which dawneth the morrow after the Sabbath, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the sepulchre.

Mark 16:1-2
1And when the Sabbath day was past, Mary Magdalen, and Mary Jacobi, and Salome, bought ointments, that they might come and anoint him.  2And early in the morning the next day after the Sabbath day, they came unto the sepulchre, when the sun was risen.  

Luke 24:1
On the morrow after the Sabbath, early in the morning, they came unto the tomb and brought the odours which they had prepared, and other women with them.

John 20:1
The morrow after the Sabbath day came Mary Magdalene early when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and saw the stone rolled away from the tomb.

Interesting to note how their day started and ended at sunset. Notwithstanding even in each of the different Gospel account expressions, less or more detail (in this case of timing) does not take away from it's message.

heman wrote:

4 in a QUANDARY (they were "amazed" is quite different from in a quandary (perplexed state-confused)


a perplexed quandry is what sounds confusing to me..

Brings to attention:
2Co 4:8 We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair, {in despair: or, altogether without help, or, means}


heman wrote:

ATTIRE LIKE FLASHING LIGHTNING (in shining vestures. esqhsiV 2067 Clothing, attire. astr?aptw 797 To flash lightning.) and meaning that the 2 men looked as though they glowed brightly with eminence and would be more significant "than shining vestures".


Ironic you mention that.. because brings to attention how your manuscript's organization (with it's government powers) persecuted William Tyndale to try stop his work; and in 1525 Anno Domini, of which God spared Tyndale; yea and at that exact time (escaping them like a flash of lightning:) in God's providence the printing press was left at:

Matthew 22:12
and said unto him: Friend, how camest thou in hither, and * hast not on a wedding garment? and he was even speechless. *[til here the text is from Tyndale's Cologne quarto fragment 1525; the text thereafter is from the Worms octavo edition of 1526.]


Last edited by JAdmin on Tue Aug 22, 2006 6:32 pm; edited 3 times in total

#12: "THE RESURRECTION" Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:22 pm
    —
COMBINING ALL FOUR GOSPELS, IT APPEARS AS THOUGH THERE ARE SOME MAJOR DIFFERENCES WHICH I HAVE UNDERLINED!!!

In Matthew 28:1 the angel descends from heaven and the stone is rolled back as Mary watches:
Interesting to see the "garments like LIGHTNING" TOO!
Then we add the Guards to the Tomb.
Mary does not see Jesus but is told to go tell the disciples and then they grab His feet and recognize him.
Verse 28 ends by saying "I am with you alway " but no mention of being taken up to heaven.

Mark 16 says the stone was already rolled away. Instead of two men "they" saw a young man. It says Jesus first appeared to Mary.
It ends by saying he was received into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

Luke 24 says "they found the stone rolled away "
And "two men stood by them" 24:9 and "returned from the sepulchre" Then Peter looked and departed not knowing what happened.
AND "that Jesus himself drew near, but did not know him.
Then women came saying, that they had "seen visions of angels". AND only after they ate, 24:31 " they knew him.
Luke ends "he departed from them, and was carried up into heaven."

John 20: Says Mary saw the stone rolled away AND that after Peter came"the disciples went away again unto their own home." Then Mary 20:12 and saw two angels clothed in white sitting AND she saw Jesus; "She turned herself, and said unto him: Rabboni which is to say master." Then Jesus relpies "20:17 Jesus said unto her: touch me not", which contradicts "20:27 Than said he to Thomas: put in thy finger here,"
The story goes on with Mary who told the disciples that she had seen the Lord,. AND THEN
came Jesus and stood in the midst, (of them)
AND adds the "FISH" story in the sea of Tiberias and John ends by saying, "I suppose the world could not contain the books that should be written." (NO ASCENSION?)

Matt 28:1 The Sabbath day at even which dawneth the morrow after the Sabbath, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the sepulchre.
28:2 And behold there was a great earthquake. For the angel of the Lord descended from heaven: and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
28:3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow.
4 For fear of him the keepers were astunned, and became as dead men
7And go quickly and tell his disciples 8 They came and held him by the feet and worshipped him.
28:20 ?And lo, I am with you alway even until the end of the world

Mark 16:1 And when the Sabbath day was past, Mary Magdalen, and Mary Jacobi, and Salome, bought ointments, that they might come and anoint him.

16:2 And early in the morning the next day after the Sabbath day, they came unto the sepulchre, when the sun was risen.
16:4 And when they beheld it, they saw how the stone was rolled away. For it was a very great one,
16:5 and they went into the sepulchre, and saw a young man, sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment, and they were abashed.
16:8 And they went out quickly and fled from the sepulchre. For they trembled and were amazed. Neither said they anything to any man, for they were afraid.
16:9 When Jesus was risen the morrow after the Sabbath day, he appeared first to Mary Magdalen,16:19 So then when the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

Luke 24:1 On the morrow after the Sabbath, early in the morning, they came unto the tomb and brought the odours which they had prepared, and other women with them. 24:2 And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre,
24:4 And it happened, as they were amazed thereat: lo two men stood by them, in shining vestures.
24:8 And they remembered his words, 24:9 and returned from the sepulchre, and told all these things unto the eleven, and to all other.
24:10 It was Mary Magdalene and Joanna, and Mary Jacobi; And other that were with them, which told these things unto the apostles,
24:12 Then arose Peter and ran unto the sepulchre, and stooped in; And saw the linen clothes laid by themself. And departed wondering in himself at that which had happened
24:15 And it chanced, as they communed together, and reasoned, that Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.
24:22 Yea and certain women also of our company made us astonied, which came early unto the sepulchre,
24:23 and found not his body. And came saying, that they had seen visions of angels which said that he was alive.
24:30 And it came to pass as he sat at meat with them, he took bread and blessed it and brake it and gave it unto them.
24:31 And their eyes were opened. And they knew him.
24:51 And it came to pass, as he blessed them, he departed from them, and was carried up into heaven.

John 20:1 The morrow after the Sabbath day came Mary Magdalene early when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and saw the stone rolled away from the tomb.
20:6 Then came Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and saw the linen clothes lie,
20:10 And the disciples went away again unto their own home.
20:11 Mary stood without at the sepulchre weeping: As she wept, she bowed herself into the sepulchre 20:12 and saw two angels clothed in white sitting
20:14 When she had thus said, she turned herself back and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
20:16 Jesus said unto her: Mary. She turned herself, and said unto him: Rabboni which is to say master.
for I have not yet ascended to my father.
20:27 Than said he to Thomas: put in thy finger here, and see my hands, and put forth thy hand and thrust him into my side, and be not without faith: but believe.
20:18 Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord,
20:19 The same day at night, which was the morrow after the Sabbath day, when the doors were shut (where the disciples were assembled together for fear of the jews,) came Jesus and stood in the midst, and said to them: peace be with you.
21:1 After that Jesus shewed himself again at the sea of Tiberias. And on this wise shewed he himself.
21:25 There are also many other things which Jesus did: the which if they should be written every one, I suppose the world could not contain the books that should be written. (NO ASCENSION?)

#13: Re: "THE RESURRECTION" Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 11:16 pm
    —
The point is that less or more detail (in it's perspective) does not take away from it's validity if according to the law and testimony. Besides only because a Gospel account did not mention a particular part (that another account mentioned) doesn't mean that it is questionable.

And seems you may have the two Marys confused..
Matthew 27:61
And there was Mary Magdalene and the other Mary sitting over against the sepulchre.



Heman wrote:
John 20 adds the "FISH" story in the sea of Tiberias and (NO ASCENSION?)

How about:
John 13:1
Before the feast of ester when Jesus knew that his hour was come, that he should depart out of this world unto the father. When he loved his which were in the world, unto the end he loved them.


John 14:16-18
16and I will pray the father, and he shall give you another comforter, that he may bide with you ever,  17which is the spirit of truth whom the world cannot receive, because the world seeth him not, neither knoweth him. But ye know him. For he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.  18I will not leave you comfortless: I will come unto you.  


John 14:28
Ye have heard how I said unto you: I go and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would verily rejoice, because I said, I go unto the father. For the father is greater than I.


John 16:4-11
4 These things have I told you, that when that hour is come, ye might remember then, that I told you so. These things said I not unto you at the beginning, because I was present with you.  5But now go I my way to him that sent me, and none of you asketh me: whither goest thou?  6but because I have said such things unto you, your hearts are full of sorrow.  7Nevertheless I tell you the truth it is expedient for you that I go away. For if I go not away, that comforter will not come unto you. But if I depart, I will send him unto you.  8And when he is come, he will rebuke the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgement.  9Of sin, because they believe not on me:  10Of righteousness, because I go to my father, and ye shall see me no more:  11And of judgement, because the chief ruler of this world, is judged all ready.  



Ephesians 4:9-16
9That he ascended: what meaneth it, but that he also descended first into the lowest parts of the earth?  10He that descended, is even the same also that ascended up, even above all heavens, to fulfil all things.  11And the very same, made some Apostles, some Prophets, some Evangelists, some Shepherds, some Teachers:  12that the saints might have all things necessary to work and minister withal, to the edifying of the body of Christ,  13till we everyeachone (in the unity of faith, and knowledge of the son of God) grow up unto a perfect man, after the measure of age which is in the fullness of Christ:  14That we henceforth be no more children wavering and carried with every wind of doctrine, by the wiliness of men and craftiness, whereby they lay a wait for us to deceive us.  15But let us follow the truth in love, and in all things grow in him which is the head, that is to say Christ,  16in whom all the body is coupled and knit together, in every joint, wherewith one ministereth to another (according to the operation as every part hath his measure) and increaseth the body, unto the edifying of itself in love.  




Jadmin wrote:
21:25 There are also many other things which Jesus did: the which if they should be written every one, I suppose the world could not contain the books that should be written.


Yea, and i perceive everybody alive on earth is like an open book coming short of the holiness of God according to the Law but are able to be safe by obedient faith through the Testimony foretold and fulfilled in the blood of Christ.


Last edited by JAdmin on Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

#14: SOMETHING FISHY? Author: hemanLocation: Joplin, MO, USA PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:41 pm
    —
John tells the FISH story, no one else includes this story.
Mark ends at 16:8 and 16:9-20 is not included .

Never the less giving rise to the character of Christ, it is without doubt that we hope in the resurrection to eternal life!

Howbeit: 1Pe 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
1Jo 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

#15: Re: SOMETHING FISHY? Author: JAdmin PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:15 pm
    —
heman wrote:
John tells the FISH story, no one else includes this story.


What's your point?
For ensample..
Matthew is the only gospel account that tells the parables of:
Weeds among the wheat 13:24-30
Treasure hidden in a field 13:44 . .
Pearl of great value 13:45, 46
Dragnet 13:47-50 . .
Unmerciful servant 18:23=25
Laborers in the vineyard 20:1-16 . .
Father and two sons 21:28-32
Marriage feast for the king's son 22:1-14 . .
Wise and foolish maidens 25:1-13
The servants and their talents 25:14-30 . .
Separating sheep from goats 25:31-46

And uniquely Mark:
Seed growing silently . 4:26-29 .
Doorkeeper on watch 11:34-37

And uniquely Luke:
Two debtors . . 7:41-43
Good samaritan 10:25-37
Friend at midnight . . 11:5-10
Rich fool 12:16-21
Watchful servants . . 12:35-38
Wise steward 12:42-48
Barren fig tree . . 13:6-9
Guests who made excuses 14:16-24
Lost coin . . 15:8-10
Prodigal son 15:11-32
Dishonest steward . . 16:1-13
Rich man and lazarus 16:19-31
Master and servant . . 17:7-10
Persistent widow 18:1-8
Pharisee and tax collector . . 18:9-14
Ten pounds 19:11-27

And the John Gospel account didn't include any parables, though included two miracles not found in the other accounts:
Changing water into wine 2:1-11
Healing of the nobleman's son . . .. 4:46-54

And many other passages likewise.



heman wrote:

Mark ends at 16:8 and 16:9-20 is not included .


Just because a particular manuscript (that came later on) omited something, doesn't mean that it was not included originally.
Mark 16:9-20 follows the author's style. And moreover the details line up with the other Gospel accounts. Yea such as the Ascension:
Mark 16:19
So then when the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

Luke 24:50-51
50And he led them out into Bethany, and lift up his hands, and blest them.  51And it came to pass, as he blessed them, he departed from them, and was carried up into heaven.  



heman wrote:

Never the less giving rise to the character of Christ, it is without doubt that we hope in the resurrection to eternal life!


Jesu Christ is come in the flesh, was risen in the flesh and bones and will resurrect all likewise.
Yea as Job long agone had proclaimed:
Job 19:23-29
23O that my words were written, O that they were put in a book:  24would God they were graven with an iron pen in lead or in stone.  25For I am sure, that my redeemer liveth, and that I shall rise out of the earth in the latter day:  26that I shall be clothed again with this skin, and see God in my flesh.  27Yea I my self shall behold him, not with other but with these same eyes. My reins are consumed within me,  28when ye say: Why do not we persecute him? We have found an occasion against him.  29But beware of the sword, for the sword will be avenged of wickedness, and be sure, that there is a judgement.  



heman wrote:

Howbeit: 1Pe 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
1Jo 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.


Purifieth how? even if you are quoting those verses in regards to the physical; is that purification according to worldly religion?
Brings to attention:
Galatians 2:3-4
3Also Titus which was with me, though he were a greek, yet was not compelled to be circumcised,  4and that because of incomers being false brethren, which came in among others to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage.  

1 Corinthians 6:12
All things are lawful unto me: but all things are not profitable. I may do all things: but I will be brought under no man's power.


Of course true purification is according to the spirit:
1 Peter 1:22-25
22And forasmuch as ye have purified your souls thorow the spirit, in obeying the truth for to love brotherly without feigning, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:  23for ye are born a new, not of mortal seed, but of immortal seed, by the word of God which liveth, and lasteth for ever,  24because that all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man is as the flower of grass, the grass is withered, and the flower is faded away,  25but the word of the Lord endureth ever. And this is the word which by the gospel was preached among you.  

1 Peter 2:1-2
1Wherefore lay a side all maliciousness, and all guile, and dissimulation, and envy, and all backbiting:  2and as new born babes, desire that reasonable milk which is without corruption, that ye may be grown therein. ([thereby unto salvation])  



DAVAR -> Original Tongues


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