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JAdmin
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 Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:48 pm Post subject: Variants from the English Scripture translations |
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Here's a compilation of divers edition variations of the first English Translations from the original tongues.
| Quote: | New Testament
* = variants mainly in the Epistles
Tyndale - Later editions | Code: | wholy -> holy
Seniours -> Elders
Dear son -> Beloved son
Majesty -> Glory
Deserving or Deserving of Works -> of works*
health -> salvation*
counterfeit -> Be followers*
Gave -> Delivered*
Favour -> Grace* |
Tyndale -> Genevan and Bishops | Code: | Congregation -> Church
Similitude -> Parable
Ester -> The Passover
Ester Lamb -> Paschal Lamb
Mount Olivet -> Mount of Olives
The ten cities -> Decapolis
Be moved -> Be shaken
Much preaching -> Many words
Seat -> Throne
Fulfil or Fulfilled -> Do or done
Excommunicate -> Put out of synagogue
People -> Nation, Multitude
Remember, Understand -> Know
Sweet bread -> Unleavened bread
Perceived or Knew well -> knew
Fortuned, Chanced, Followed -> It came to pass, So it was
Liberality, Benelovence -> Grace*
Deeds -> Works* |
Tyndale -> Cranmer, Geneva, and Bishops | Code: |
Is my delite -> I am well pleased
Thy Lord God -> The Lord thy God
Hallowed loaves -> Shew bread
Commandment -> Word
Pray -> Worship
Be safe -> Be saved
Lo or Take heed -> Behold
Happy -> Blessed
Lawd or Lawded -> Praise, Praised
Be hurt or Fall -> Be offended
Hurt -> Wrong
Occasions of evil -> Offenses
Uncovered -> Revealed
Opened, Apeared, or Shewed -> Make manifest
Ascend -> Go up
Descend -> come down
Pure -> Holy*
Informed -> Instructed*
Morow -> Next day*
Unbelief -> Disobedience* |
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| Quote: | Pentateuch - first five books of Moses
1530 Tyndale -> 1537 Mathew's bible
Genesis | Quote: | 1:20 flee -> fly
1:26 rule -> dominion
2:17 surely die -> die the death
3:1 ah sir, that God hath said -> ye, hath God said in deed
3:6 ran against -> ran to meet
4:10 crieth -> cried
8:10 more -> mo
12:19 the wife -> thy wife
14:17 against -> to meet
15:5 out at the doors -> out of the doors
15:10 one over against a nother -> one against another
16:13 parties -> parts
17:19 God: na, Sara .. a son, and -> God: Sarah .. a son in deed and
17:20 he -> be
18:2 ran against them -> ran to meet them
19:1 up against them -> up to meet them
20:16 he -> this thing
20:17 bare -> bare children
21:1 had spoken. -> promised
22:2 land of Moria -> land Moria
24:17 sip -> sup
26:19 springing water -> living water
31:20 done unknowing to me? and hast carried away.. with sword -> done to steal away my heart, and carry away.. with the sword?
31:26 And Iacob went away unknowing to Laban.. & told him -> And Iacob stale away the hart of Laban.. in that he told him
33:4 ran against him -> ran to meet him
33:11 me freely. And -> me. And
33:18 Salem -> came peaceably in
35:7 place Elbethel -> place Bethel
41:27 are .vii. years -> are .vii. ears
41:39 nor of -> or of
43:12 again with you in your hands, peradventure -> again with you, peradventure
44:18 lord's audience -> lord's ear
46:29 went against Israel -> went to meet Israel
46:34 For an abhomination unto the Egyptians are all that feed sheep -> For the Egyptians abore all shepherds
49:22 the daugthers come forth to bear rule -> the daughters ran upon the wall
49:25 wombs -> womb |
Exodus | Quote: | 2:23 --- -> [And she bare yet another son, whom he called Elieser saying: the God of my father is mine helper, and hath rid me out of the hands of Pharao.]
10:17 How long shall this fellow thus plague us? -> How long shall we be thus evilly entreated?
10:22 dark mist -> thick darkness
15:4, 15:22 redde -> reed
17:15 Iehouah Nissi, -> The LORD is he that exalteth, or worketh miracles for me.
25:9 as I have shewed -> And i shall shew
26:11 tabernacle. -> covering
28:15, 29 brestplate of ensample -> brestplate of judgement
28:30 blight and perfectness -> Urim and Thumin
29:3 maund with the oil -> maund with the ox
30:13 after the holy sicle -> after the sicle of the sanctuary |
Leviticus | Quote: | 4:32 sheep -> lamb
4:32 ewe -> female
5:6 ewe -> lamb
5:15 holy sicle, -> holy sicle of the sanctuary,
6:28 plunged -> rinsed
6:29 Aaron -> the priests
13:13,17,20,22,23, 25,27,30,34,36,37,44,59 make -> judge
14:4,6,52 cypress wood -> cedar wood
14:5,50 over -> in
14:50 of -> with
15:28 is cleansed -> be clean
16:3 young ox -> bullock
16:6 ox -> bullock
18:12,13 kin. -> kinswoman.
18:14 open -> uncover
20:5 household -> generation
20:18 unheal.. uncover -> uncover.. open
20:27 or a maker of sismal days -> or that expondeth tokens
21:18 any monstrous member -> any misshapen member
24:3 vail of testimony -> vail of witness
24:14 him that cursed -> him that blasphemed
25:10 a year of horns blowing -> a year of jubilee
25:15 the trompet year -> the year of jubilee
25:28 the horn year -> jubilee
25:30 trompet year -> of jubilee
25:30,31,33,40; 27:33 trompet year -> of jubilee
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Numbers | Quote: | 1:46 hundred thoudand -> hundred [and three] thousand
3:31 the ark -> [to keep] the ark
4:4 even in the most holy place. -> [This shall be the office of the Kahath in the tabernacle of witness which is most holy.]
5:3 I -> ye
9:6 day -> time
9:23 wait -> watch
10:2 hard silver -> beaten silver
10:19 Salamiel -> Salamiel [the son of Zuri saddai.]
10:20 the son of Deguel. -> [And over the host of the tribe of the children of Gad was Eliasaph] the son of Deguel.
11:1 waxed unpacient -> complained
11:35 graves of lust -> kibrath hathavah
19:6 cypress wood -> cedar wood
19:13 twicheth -> toucheth
21:20 the wilderness -> Iesimon
21:29 forloren -> undone
22:39 Huzoth -> large city
23:21 tromp -> triumph
27:21 the manner of the light -> judgement of Urim
23:1 oxen -> bullocks
32:17,36 strong cities -> fenced cities
33:9 datetrees -> palmtrees
33:31 children of Iaecon -> Bane Iakan
33:52 their imaginations -> chapels
35:6 more -> mo
35:19 judge of blood -> justice of blood
36:4 free year -> of jubilee |
Deuteronomy | Quote: | 1:17 law is God's -> judgment is God's
3:14 Jair -> [Havoth] Jair
4:40 giveth thee for ever. -> giveth thee thy life long
4:45 witness -> witnesses
8:15 thirst -> drouth
10:4 gathered) -> gathered together)
10:6 Ben Iaken -> children of Iakan
11:23 these nations -> these nations [and ye shall conquer them which are] both
15:2, 22:2 axe -> ask
16:7 eat -> eat [it]
16:16 booth feast. -> feast of the tabernacles.
16:18 cities -> gates
16:32 holy linen vestements -> holy linen [clothes and holy] vestments
18:14 makers of dismal days and bruterars -> choosers out of dismal days and prophesyars, or profit-seers
25:1 When -> If
25:3 ungodly -> ungoodly
25:4 muzzle -> mosell
28:38 locusts -> grasshoppers
29:49 fleeth: -> flyeth
29:9 word -> words
29:19 I fear it not, -> shall have peace
29:19 walk -> work
29:19 destroy -> may perish with
31:4 do -> go
32:43 Rejoice -> Praise ye
32:41 whet the lightning of my sword -> whet the edge of my sword
33:21 teachers were -> teacher was
34:3 datetrees -> palm trees
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Last edited by JAdmin on Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:25 am; edited 6 times in total |
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heman
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Location: Joplin, MO, USA
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| Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 12:33 am Post subject: |
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WT
Acts 26:28
Agrippa said unto Paul: Somewhat thou bringest me in mind for|Thou persuadest me in a part| to become christen.{for to be come a Christen}
26:29
And Paul said: I would to God that not only thou: but also all that hear me today, were not somewhat only, but altogether such as I am except these bonds.|(not only in a part but alltogether,) I might persuade not thee only, but all them that hear me this day, to be such as I am, these bonds except|
Take a look at Acts 26 v 28 in the King James version and the New International Version:
KJV:
"Then Agrippa said unto Paul: Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian"
NIV:
"Then Agrippa said to Paul: Do you think that in such a short time you can persuade me to be a Christian?"
Now we are missing something here, or does this same passage, from different versions, seem to be completely contradictory? In the KJV Agrippa is saying that Paul's arguments are so strong that he is almost convincing him. In the NIV however, he tears a strip off Paul and mocks him.
But look at the preceding verse 27. What does Paul say?
Ac 26:27 King Agrippa, believest thou the prophets? I know that thou believest.
Ac 26:28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost a little thou persuadest me to be a Christian.
29 And Paul said, I would to God, that not only thou, but also all that hear me this day, were both almost a little, and altogether such as I am, except these bonds.
Codex Vaticanus (B)
Acts 26:28,29 they left out this word: a ολιγω 3641 Few, little, short, brief.
And also left out πιοησαι 4162 Preforming
Verse 28 actually reads thus with the two extra words not contained in the others that I have bolded and underlined:
ο δε αγριππασ προσ τον παυλον εν ολιγω με πιεθεισ χρειστιανον πιοησαι
The and Agrippa to the Paul within a little me thou persuadest a Christian preforming
_________________
"The Singer"
1Ch 15:19 So the singers, Heman, Asaph, and Ethan, were appointed to sound with cymbals of brass;
1Ch 25:5 All these were the sons of HEMAN, THE KING'S SEER IN THE WORDS OF GOD |
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JAdmin
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Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 279
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| Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 1:41 am Post subject: |
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Very interesting observation. Thanks!
Seems WT got the non--contradictory meaning right
|along with Coverdale and friends' variant from the Dutch and Old Latin| |
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heman
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 2:22 am Post subject: |
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For example, consider the following three sentences translating Proverbs 17:11: 37
KJV: An evil seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him
(notice the word "man" is not in the originals)
RSV: An evil man seeks only rebellion, and a cruel messenger will be sent against him.
NRSV: Evil people seek only rebellion, but a cruel messenger will be sent against them.
They express approximately the same truth, that is, the same meaning. In terms of form "man" is grammatically singular and masculine. "People" is grammatically plural and not marked for gender and neither are in the original.
In John 3 do the Red Letter words of Jesus end at verse 15 or at verse 21 ? Another difficulty confronts translators today because of the inability of modern English to differentiate between "you" singular number and "you" plural number.
A famous gentleman once said,"Never forget, gentlemen, that this is not the Bible." Then, after a moment?s pause, he continued, "This, gentlemen, is only a translation of the Bible." Richard Whately (1787?1863)
In John 3 do the words of Jesus end at verse 15 or at verse 21 ? Another difficulty confronts translators today because of the inability of modern English to differentiate between "you" singular number and "you" plural number.
| Quote: | | Faithfully rendering his speech in another language means attending all aspects of God's speech, not just the words in isolation. |
Consider another, more complex case. Compare two translations of Ephesians 1:18:
... that you may know what is the hope of His calling, (NASB)
... that you may know what is the hope to which he has called you, (RSV)
The underlying Greek, word-for-word, runs like this: "the hope of the calling of you what the wealth of the glory of the inheritance of him?."
But now there is still a difficulty. "Of" in English is a perfect match for the underlying Greek construction, which uses the genitive case. "Of" is not an exact equivalent. But in fact, in this case at least, it produces no possibility of misunderstanding. And the restructuring ("that you may know what is the hope of your calling") "Your" is more specific, more concrete, more focused on the Ephesians. and has no potential liabilities, and we need to be well aware of that.
English readers may easily misunderstand the NASB as meaning "the hope that he will call you." But that is not what Paul means. In Greek the actual meaning is closer to "the hope of your calling" or "hope arising from his calling". The RSV, NIV, and GNB all have "the hope to which he has called you," which takes away from the original meaning of the individual calling and possession of the promise of inheritance.
They have also put in the extra word "you." That word is there in Greek. By implication, it is "your." But that is not what it actually conveys and in English it results in a meaning slightly more definite than the Greek. "Your calling" in Greek has to do with God's calling of individual people. As a word picture, it opens the horizon to anyone whom God calls. In addition, the RSV/NIV/GNB wording suggests that the whole point of God's calling is to have hope in the inheritance with the saints. The Greek leaves one more open to the broader possibility, namely that God's call to be a Christian includes many aspects, only one of which is the hope for fulfillment of his plan. This latter view is the one that in fact occurs elsewhere in Paul (Eph. 4:1; 1 Cor. 1:9; etc.).
WT
Correctly notes
1:18
and lighten the eyes of your minds,|understanding| that ye might know what thing that hope is, whereunto he hath called you,|what is the hope of your calling| and how glorious the riches of his{what the riches of his glorious} inheritance is upon the saints,
In Christ,
Heman
_________________
"The Singer"
1Ch 15:19 So the singers, Heman, Asaph, and Ethan, were appointed to sound with cymbals of brass;
1Ch 25:5 All these were the sons of HEMAN, THE KING'S SEER IN THE WORDS OF GOD |
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JAdmin
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 1:04 pm Post subject: diligency and eloquency |
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The TRC rightly giveth the passage more justice:| Proverbs 17:11 | | A sedicious person seeketh mischief, but a cruel messenger shall be sent against him. |
The problem with some translations is that they become so tangled in some "same name" organization that they put the context of most passages into a mysterious bondage. The word "evil" is a perfect example thereof. Nonetheless sometimes even two to three words are needed to translate a language meaning to another language, specially from Hebrew with it's many significances.
In regards to John 3: the Red Letter words of Jesus end at verse 21.
Though of course this can be opened to diligently comprehend that the Apostle inspired by the wholy ghost (as it was brought to his remembrance) gave a summary of what was taught by Christ, because right "after that" it is said: | Quote: | John 3:22
After that{these things} came Jesus and his disciples into the jews' land, and there abode{he haunted} with them and baptised, |
Translators today ought to have reverence for the language more than for what others (being stubbornly picky) might imagine to want about it. After all it was not just the translator but the expression found in the Scripture translation itself that gave us our uniform language. William Tyndale and the English language is a great ensample of that fact. He even coined many new interesting words such as "Passover" and "atonement" to convey the right significance. And other languages shouldn't be any different in that expressive liberty.. though most languages have de-evolved, most still have a distinguishment between "you" singular and plural.
And in English if sombebody is too lazy to learn the difference between the singular "thou", "thee", "thine", and plural "ye" (still honoured in poetry and song of importance) then how can they preceive the more important Scriptures that require much more diligent effort?
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| heman wrote: | | A famous gentleman once said,"Never forget, gentlemen, that this is not the Bible." Then, after a moment?s pause, he continued, "This, gentlemen, is only a translation of the Bible." Richard Whately (1787?1863) |
IMHO. Perhaps William Tyndale even humbly agrees according to his first NT prologue of 1525: | Quote: | | I have here translated (brethren and sisters most dear and tenderly beloved in Christ) the new Testament for your spiritual edifying, consolation and solace: Exhorting instantly and beseeching those that are better seen in the tongues than I, and that have higher gifts of grace to interpret the sense of the Scripture, and meaning of the Spirit, than I, to consider and ponder my labor, and that with the spirit of meekness. And if they perceive in any places that I have not attained the very sense of the tongue, or meaning of the Scripture, or have not given the right English word, that they put to their hands to amend it, remembering that so is their duty to do. For we have not received the gifts of God for ourselves only, or for to hide them; but for to bestow them unto the honoring of God and Christ, and edifying of the congregation, which is the body of Christ. |
Notwithstanding, we know today (yea seeing it's good fruits) that this was written before the so called "church" tried to heavily persecute him, even God's own work, and have strangled it and burned it alive.. albeit before a prayer that was mightily answered: | Quote: | | (morning of 6 October) A.D. 1536; crying at the stake with a fervent zeal, and a loud voice, "Lord! open the king of England's eyes." -- Foxe's Book of Martyrs |
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| heman wrote: | | Faithfully rendering his speech in another language means attending all aspects of God's speech, not just the words in isolation. |
Goes without saying with what was said about diligency in translation liberty and expression to convey the original inspiration.
| Quote: | | 1Co 1:9 <[For]> God is faithful, by whom ye are called unto the fellowship of his son Jesus Christ our Lord. |
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