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#1: love and charity Author: JAdmin,

Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 7:58 pm
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The devout meaning of love is nicely given in:

1 Corinthians 13:4-7

4Love suffereth long, and is courteous. Love envieth not. Love doth not frowardly, swelleth not, 5dealeth not dishonestly, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh not evil 6rejoiceth not in iniquity: but rejoiceth in the truth, 7suffereth all things, believeth all things hopeth all things, endureth in all things.

Other translations may use the word charity.. but the meaning somewhat has grown cold over the years, even since the reformation of the above first English translation from the original tongues that came from the pen of a martyr that instead used Love. Notwithstanding, according to the ensample of Christ, the word Charity can even have clarity IF understood as divine love in action:

Code:

1. loving your neighbor in deed
2. benelovence
3. goodness
4. compassion
5. joyfully giving to the needy
6. beneficent
7. kindly generous

It can even be summarized in a poem:

Code:

Love is a reward to profit withal
Joy that makes a cheerful giver
Peace that is of a Justice lover
Longsuffering in gentleness
Goodness followed intimately
Faithfulness celebrated in Liberty.
Meekness is it?s precious inheritence
Temperance that gives sprout in life.

Last edited by JAdmin on Sat Jul 22, 2006 4:22 pm; edited 2 times in total

#2: Love Author: heman, Location: Joplin, MO, USA

Posted: Wed May 31, 2006 7:31 pm
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Η αγαπην μακροθυρει
The love suffers long

αγαπην is so rendered in all manuscripts to date.
Codex Vaticanus (B),and( Codex Sinaiticus )

#3: patience Author: JAdmin,

Posted: Wed May 31, 2006 9:41 pm
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The love is patient.

The greek αγαπη ag-ah'-pay according to strongs is love, i.e. affection or benevolence; specially (plural) a love-feast:--(feast of) charity(-ably), dear, love.

In Hebrew love is האהבה a-hab-aw means love directed at something, and even God's love to His people

In Latin it is caritas where we got charity that pertains to love, affection, esteem, favor; dearness; high price.

To me it is divine love in action.

#4: love Author: heman, Location: Joplin, MO, USA

Posted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 7:50 pm
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WT
1Cor 12:31Covet after the best gifts. And yet shew I unto you a more
excellent way.
13:1Though I spake with the tongues of men and angels, and yet had no love, I were even as sounding brass: ands as a tinkling cymbal.
13:2And though I could prophesy, and understood all secrets, and
all knowledge: yea, if I had all faith so that I could move mountains out of their places, and yet had no love, I were nothing.
13:3And though I bestowed all my goods to feed the poor, and though I gave my body even that I burned, and yet had no love, it profiteth me nothing.
13:4Love suffereth long, and is courteous. Love envieth not.
Love doth not frowardly, swelleth not, u
13:5dealeth not dishonestly, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh not evil 13:6rejoiceth not in iniquity: but rejoiceth in the truth,
13:7suffereth all things, believeth all things hopeth all things, endureth in all things.
13:8Though that prophesying fail, or tongues shall cease, or
knowledge vanish away: yet love falleth never away.
13:9For our knowledge is unperfect, and our prophesying is unperfect:
13:10but when that which is perfect is come: then that which is unperfect shall be done away.

Which actually reads as I have underscored and bolded:paying particular attention to 13:3 to vaunt καυχησωμαι(2744) Major1: verb Person: 1st Tense: aorist Voice: middle
Mood: subjunctive Number: singular;
and not καυθησωμαι(2545) as WT indicates.
1 Cor 12:31You earnestly desire those gracious gifts. And better yet I point out to you that aboundant(5236) path(3598).
13:1If I speak with the tongues of men and angels, but I have no love, I have become as sounding brass: or a noisy cymbal.
13:2And if I have prophesy, and I know all secrets, and
all the knowledge: and if I had all the faith so that I could remove mountains but have not love, I am nothing.
13:3 And if I bestow all my possessions and even hand over my body ,so that to vaunt (2744)love, but do not have, it profiteth me nothing.
13:4 The love suffers long, is gentle, not envies to vaunt(4068), is not puffed up,
13:5 acts not indecently, seeks not her own, is not provoked to anger, inflicts not evil(2560),
13:6 does not rejoice in the injustice: but rejoices with the truth,
13:7 sustains all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things, love never falls away.
13:8 But wheither prophesying will be done away, wheither tongues will cease, wheither knowledge will be done away:
13:9 For from parts we know, and from parts we prophesy:
13:10 but when the perfect may come: that from parts will be done away
Codex Vaticanus (B),and( Codex Sinaiticus ), elightens your prospective does it not??

#5: high price Author: JAdmin,

Posted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:16 pm
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W.T. did not use the "Greek" alone as his only source; besides it is not fair to judge his translation that conveys the same, though with a unique expression thereof. And ironically since he literally gave his body even that he burned as a martyr, but with such prayerful love that profited everybody with the first English translation of the Wholy Scriptures from the original tongues.

Moreover to stay on the topic of love and charity ..

Even the Greek "alone" is limited to enlightment according to the love definition thereof.

The Hebrew more strongly emphasizes the action of love, such as directed by God to his people.

And in Latin, love is expressed even as the ultimate price, yea as expressed by Christ.

Put it all together and it more precisely gives the whole picture.

John 19:20

This title read many of the jews. For the place where Jesus was crucified, was nigh to the city. And it was written in hebrew, greek and latin.

Last edited by JAdmin on Sat Jul 22, 2006 6:01 pm; edited 1 time in total

#6: Author: heman, Location: Joplin, MO, USA

Posted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 11:37 pm
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13:10 but when the perfect may come: that from parts will be done away
1Th 2:4 But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts.

2Co 10:7 Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christ?s, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ?s, even so are we Christ?s.

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

Ro 5:21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Lu 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.

#7: Author: JAdmin,

Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 12:45 am
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John 3:16-21

16 God so loved the world, that he gave his only son for the intent, that none that believe in him, should perish: But should have everlasting life. 17For God sent not his son into the world, to condemn the world: But that the world through him, might be saved. 18He that believeth on him shall not be condemned. But he that believeth not, is condemned all ready, because he believeth not in the name of the only son of God. 19And this is the condemnation: Light is come into the world, and the men have loved darkness more than light, because their deeds were evil. 20For every man that evil doeth, hateth the light: neither cometh to light, lest his deeds should be reproved. 21But he that doth truth, cometh to the light, that his deeds might be known, how that they are wrought in God.

Luke 6:43-45

43It is not a good tree that bringeth forth evil fruit: Neither is that an evil tree, that bringeth forth good fruit. 44For every tree is known by his fruit. Neither of thorns gather men figs, nor of bushes gather they grapes. 45A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good. And the evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart, bringeth forth that which is evil. For of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaketh.

#8: Author: heman, Location: Joplin, MO, USA

Posted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:45 pm
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13:10 but when the whole (5046) may come: that from parts will cease.
13:12Now we see
through a mirror even in an obscure saying: but
then shall we see face to face. Now I
know from parts: but then shall I know
even as I am known. 13:13Now abideth
faith, hope, and love, even these three:
but the greater of these the love.

Codex Vaticanus (B),and( Codex Sinaiticus ),

The εσοπτρου (mirror) is understood to be a transparent substance, which the ancients, in the imperfect state of arts, used in their windows; such as thin plates of horn, transparent stone, ill prepared glass like mirrors, through which they saw objects without, but obscurley. - (Bloomfield)

Jas 1:23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a mirror:

2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and being an exact impress (χαρακτηρ 5481) of the substance of him, and sustaining all things by the word of his power, and having made a purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty in high places;

Elightens your prospective does it not?? Whole then parts, mirror then obscurley?
And how about Face to Face ?

Nu 14:14 And they will tell it to the inhabitants of this land: for they have heard that thou LORD art among this people, that thou LORD art seen face to face, and that thy cloud standeth over them, and that thou goest before them, by day time in a pillar of a cloud, and in a pillar of fire by night.

Re 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

Ro 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be an atonement-seat; through faith by his blood, to point out his righteousness through the passing by of sins that were past committed, in the forbearance of God;

Heb 9:5 And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the atonement-seat; of which we cannot now speak in part.

ιλαστηριον 2435 An atonement-seat; the lid of the ark of the
covenant; an expiatory sacrifice.
The word never signifies propitiation as it is translated in the common version, but always is used wherever it occurs, both in the OT and NT to express the golden lid of the ark upon which the Shechinah or cloud of glory rested, and from which oracles were dispensed.
See Ex 25:22;Num 7:3,9; Lev 17:2; Heb 9:5

#9: seat of love Author: JAdmin,

Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 12:11 am
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1 Corinthians 13:9-13

9For our knowledge is unperfect, and our prophesying is unperfect: 10but when that which is perfect is come: then that which is unperfect shall be done away. 11When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I imagined as a child: but as soon as I was a man I put away childishness. 12Now we see in a glass even in a dark speaking: but then shall we see face to face. Now I know unperfectly: but then shall I know even as I am known. 13Now abideth faith, hope, and love, even these three: but the chief of these is love.

Similar terminology such as glass can better get at the root of what men are like. (1Pe. 1:24-25, Isa. 40:6-8)

2 Corinthians 3:18

And now the Lord's glory appeareth in us all, as in a glass: and we are changed unto the same similitude, from glory to glory, even of the Lord which is a spirit.

James 1:23

For if any hear the word, and do it not, he is like unto a man that beholdeth his bodily face in a glass.

Moreover taking into account how the son of God is God's perfect image:

Hebrews 1:3-4

3Which son being the brightness of his glory, and very image of his substance, bearing up all things with the word of his power, hath in his own person purged our sins, and is sitten on the right hand of the majesty on high, 4and is more excellent than the angels, inasmuch as he hath by inheritance obtained an excellenter name then have they.

notwithstanding

Code:

Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame. It is an unruly evil full of deadly poison.
Jas 3:9 Therewith bless we God the father, and therewith curse we men which are made after the ([image and]) similitude of God.

Also..
It's interesting that WT is who likewise translated the following:

Romans 3:25

whom God hath made a seat of mercy thorow faith in his blood, to shew the righteousness which before him is of valour, in that he forgiveth the sins that are passed,

Hebrews 9:5

Over the ark were the cherubims of glory shadowing the seat of grace. Of which things, we will not now speak particularly.

And though Tyndale is who even coined the word atonement, he decided to use a seat of mercy and grace to justly discern the spiritual.

Bearing in mind:

1 John 3:2

Dearly beloved, now are we the sons of God, and yet it hath not appear what we shall be. But we know that when it shall appear, we shall be like him. For we shall see him as he is.

1 John 4:7-21

7Dearly beloved, let us love one another: for love cometh of God. And every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not, hath not known God: for God is love. 9In this appeared the love of God to us ward, because that God sent his only begotten son into the world, that we might live thorow him. 10Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his son to make agreement for our sins. 11Dearly beloved if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another. 12No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfect in us. 13Hereby know we, that we dwell in him, and he in us: because he hath given us of his spirit. 14And we have seen and do testify that the father sent the son, the saviour of the world. 15Whosoever confesseth that Jesus is the son of God, in him dwelleth God, and he in God. 16And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love, and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him. 17Herein is the love perfect in us, that we should have trust in the day of judgment, that as he is, even so are we in this world. 18There is no fear in love, but perfect love casteth out all fear, for fear hath painfulness. He that feareth is not perfect in love. 19We love him, for he loved us first. 20If a man say, I love God, and yet hate his brother, he is a liar. How can he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, love God whom he hath not seen? 21And this commandment have we of him: that he which loveth God, should love his brother also.

Last edited by JAdmin on Sat Jun 03, 2006 12:30 pm; edited 1 time in total

#10: Re: seat of love Author: heman, Location: Joplin, MO, USA

Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 1:20 am
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JAdmin wrote:

1 Corinthians 13:9-13

You missed the point that we only have a part but when the Whole (Jesus) comes we shall have it all and no longer just a part.
9For our knowledge is a part, and our prophesying is a part:
13:10 but when the whole (5046) may come: that from parts will cease.
13:12Now we see through a mirror even in an obscure saying: but
then shall we see face to face. Now I know from parts: but then shall I know (The Whole) even as I am known.

Quote:

Similar terminology such as glass can better get at the root of what men are like. (1Pe. 1:24-25, Isa. 40:6-8)

That is partially true, however the mirror reflects your image even obscurely, like a cloud whereas a glass may be transparent and give no reflection at all.

Quote:

2 Corinthians 3:18

And now the Lord's glory appeareth in us all, as in a glass: and we are changed unto the same similitude, from glory to glory, even of the Lord which is a spirit.

What do you see in a mirror if not a doer, just your earthly image and not a godly image in his likeness. You see yourself as a man and not a man of God.

Quote:

James 1:23

For if any hear the word, and do it not, he is like unto a man that beholdeth his bodily face in a glass.

Jas 1:23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a mirror:

Quote:

Moreover taking into account how the son of God is God's perfect image:

We can see from our own reflection openly wheither we are showing the image of God to other people.
2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Quote:

Hebrews 1:3-4

Just as Christ reflects the light of the same mirror image of a mark, stamp, impression, character; an effect of substance by his word so that we also have the same effect on other people.
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and being an exact impress (5481) of the substance of him, and sustaining all things by the word of his power, and having made a purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty in high places;

Quote:

Also..
It's interesting that WT is who likewise translated the following:

Romans 3:25

whom God hath made a seat of mercy thorow faith in his blood, to shew the righteousness which before him is of valour, in that he forgiveth the sins that are passed,

Hebrews 9:5

Over the ark were the cherubims of glory shadowing the seat of grace. Of which things, we will not now speak particularly.

And though Tyndale is who even coined the word atonement, he decided to use a seat of mercy and grace to justly discern the spiritual. (1Co 2:14, 2Ti. 2:15)

Bearing in mind:

1 John 3:2

Dearly beloved, now are we the sons of God, and yet it hath not appear what we shall be. But we know that when it shall appear, we shall be like him. For we shall see him as he is.

1 John 4:7-21

Nu 14:14 And they will tell it to the inhabitants of this land: for they have heard that thou LORD art among this people, that thou LORD art seen face to face, and that thy cloud standeth over them, and that thou goest before them, by day time in a pillar of a cloud, and in a pillar of fire by night.
1Co 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
Lu 21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Amen to that!

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